Preprints
https://doi.org/10.5194/wes-2024-108
https://doi.org/10.5194/wes-2024-108
09 Sep 2024
 | 09 Sep 2024
Status: a revised version of this preprint was accepted for the journal WES and is expected to appear here in due course.

On the lidar-turbulence paradox and possible countermeasures

Alfredo Peña, Ginka Georgieva Yankova, and Vasiliki Mallini

Abstract. We describe the major difficulties in establishing a physics-based method that corrects lidar-based turbulence measures so that they become equivalent to standard turbulence measures. The difficulties encompass the so-called lidar-turbulence paradox, which we circumvent in two ways. The first uses a physics-based lidar-turbulence model and the second directly uses lidar measurements, both approaches aiming at training neural networks. The measurements are from continuous-wave Doppler lidar wind profilers deployed besides a tall 250-m meteorological mast at the Østerild test station in Denmark. Sonic anemometers on the mast match four lidar measurement levels, from 37 up to 241-m height. The physics-based lidar-turbulence model predicts well the behavior of the ratio of the lidar-to-sonic along- and cross-wind velocity variance up to 103 m. However, it predicts further decreasing ratios at 175 and 241 m, while the observations show increasing ratios for a number of stability conditions and length-scale ranges. The physics-based lidar-turbulence model is used to produce physics-based datasets, which are utilized to train neural networks. Compared to turbulence intensity measurements from a first lidar, the predictions of these neural networks are in better agreement with the sonic-based measures for most mean wind speed bins at 37 and 103 m. At 175 and 241 m, the predictions' accuracy reduces and better agreement is achieved within the highest mean wind speed ranges only. Measurements from a second lidar are used to generate predictions of turbulence intensity with neural networks trained with measurements from the first lidar. At 37 and 103 m, these predictions are also in better agreement with the sonic-based measures than those of the second lidar for most mean wind speed ranges. However, at 175 and 241 m, turbulence measures derived from the second lidar are generally close to the sonic-based values, while the predictions overestimate them. We speculate either that the assumption of turbulence homogeneity within the lidar scanning pattern might not hold at the site and/or that the Doppler radial velocity spectra of the lidars might be contaminated, thus impacting the radial velocity estimates particularly with increasing focus distance.

Publisher's note: Copernicus Publications remains neutral with regard to jurisdictional claims made in the text, published maps, institutional affiliations, or any other geographical representation in this preprint. The responsibility to include appropriate place names lies with the authors.
Alfredo Peña, Ginka Georgieva Yankova, and Vasiliki Mallini

Status: closed

Comment types: AC – author | RC – referee | CC – community | EC – editor | CEC – chief editor | : Report abuse
  • RC1: 'Comment on wes-2024-108', Anonymous Referee #1, 29 Sep 2024
    • AC1: 'Reply on RC1', Alfredo Peña, 07 Nov 2024
  • RC2: 'Comment on wes-2024-108', Anonymous Referee #2, 01 Oct 2024
    • AC2: 'Reply on RC2', Alfredo Peña, 07 Nov 2024

Status: closed

Comment types: AC – author | RC – referee | CC – community | EC – editor | CEC – chief editor | : Report abuse
  • RC1: 'Comment on wes-2024-108', Anonymous Referee #1, 29 Sep 2024
    • AC1: 'Reply on RC1', Alfredo Peña, 07 Nov 2024
  • RC2: 'Comment on wes-2024-108', Anonymous Referee #2, 01 Oct 2024
    • AC2: 'Reply on RC2', Alfredo Peña, 07 Nov 2024
Alfredo Peña, Ginka Georgieva Yankova, and Vasiliki Mallini

Data sets

Datasets for "On the lidar-turbulence paradox and possible countermeasures" Alfredo Peña https://figshare.com/s/0b82ac46e49215b81bd2

Alfredo Peña, Ginka Georgieva Yankova, and Vasiliki Mallini

Viewed

Total article views: 573 (including HTML, PDF, and XML)
HTML PDF XML Total BibTeX EndNote
278 65 230 573 8 9
  • HTML: 278
  • PDF: 65
  • XML: 230
  • Total: 573
  • BibTeX: 8
  • EndNote: 9
Views and downloads (calculated since 09 Sep 2024)
Cumulative views and downloads (calculated since 09 Sep 2024)

Viewed (geographical distribution)

Total article views: 565 (including HTML, PDF, and XML) Thereof 565 with geography defined and 0 with unknown origin.
Country # Views %
  • 1
1
 
 
 
 
Latest update: 13 Dec 2024
Download
Short summary
Lidars are vastly used in wind energy but most users struggle when interpreting lidar turbulence measures. Here we explain why is difficult to convert them into standard measurements. We show two ways to convert lidar to in-situ turbulence measurements, both using neural networks with one of them based on physics while the other is purely data driven. They show promising results when compared to high-quality turbulence measurements from a tall mast.
Special issue
Altmetrics